Pariprashnena — Q&A Archive

similar question was put to our friend Sankarshan from Texas:

Question: Who is the Doer?

Namaste. If we ourselves are not the doer, then we are so many puppets on strings pulled by God. We have no free will. Who, in fact, is the doer in my local field of activity? Is it me, or is it the Cosmic Puppeteer? I dont mean to sound offensive. I am simply confused. Please help me to understand the true nature of this reality, that of the doer in the field. Love always...

Tommi

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Answer: Supreme Doer and Subordinate Doer

Both you and God are the doers. He is the supreme doer because He is the master programmer who has programmed both the spiritual world and the material world. And you are also the doer, the subordinate doer, because you have full freedom to flip between the two different channels at will. You are the subordinate doer because although you have complete total freedom to choose which program you want to be tuned into, it is God who makes the programs, not you.

Everyone is acting under the direction of God. Thats a fact. But we have a choice how we want to be a directed. In a state the citizens have a choice of being law-abiding citizens or criminals. If they choose to be law-abiding citizens they voluntarily co-operate with the laws of the state and enjoy the full benefits of citizenship. But if they choose to be criminals, they are brought under the stringent control of the state by being placed in the prison.

So we have a choice. Do we want to voluntarily place ourselves under the Lords direction, or do we want to try defy His authority and be placed under the stringent control of His material energy? In either case we are under the Lords control. But the devotee chooses voluntarily to serve the Lord and thus relishes an eternal life full of knowledge of bliss while the non-devotee chooses to defy the Lord and thus suffers birth after birth in the cycle of birth, death, old age, and disease.

Sankarshan Das Adhikari

Actually the answer is many fold:

For a conditioned soul (soul completely under the influence of the three modes) he/she is bewildered by the influence of false ego and thinks himself the doer of activities that are in actuality carried out by the three modes of material nature. (BG 3.27) (Because he identifies with the body and the senses not because he/she knows to be the soul see also Bhag. 11.11.10)

For a soul attaining liberation via karma yoga the question who is the doer-the living entity, material nature or Krsna as Paramatma- is answered in Bg. 5.13-15 (soul is not a doer Gita repeats the word "na" three times (na kartrtvam na karmani na karma-phala-samyogam) , material nature is the doer and Krishna controls the nature but is not the doer and God does not accept any reactions (karma)). In this way one can do akarma on the karma-yoga path.

On the jnana marga doer is ksetrajna (not the doer of karma) and Paramatma is the permitter. This is the doer but not of karma, but of activities in knowledge.

For a sadhaka doer (of the progress/sadhana) on the path of akarma it is God himself (or worshipable deity/guru). We do not think that we can make it on our own, so the credit (who is the doer) goes to the worshipable deity.

amany amatsaro dakso nirmamo drdha-sauhrdah

The servant or disciple of the spiritual master should be free from false prestige, never considering himself to be the doer. (Bhag 11.10.6) and per SB 12.10.31-32 actually considers Supreme Lord to be the doer in this material world, and thus is on the platform of akarma and knows that Nature is not the doer (rather different concept to the karma path). However such person will see for other peoples karma (that he is not involved in) that jiva is the doer and God is the giver. So this sadhaka may think that it is Guru-deva or Krishna himself who is the doer (of his good fortune in sadhana/those who produce the fruit), and all credit goes to them, where as the souls (not the body) are responsible for karma they get.

On the platform of bhava on the raga-marga the ista-devata or a particular resident (that you follow in the footsteps of) in Vrindavana (say Sri Lalita) is that person you give all the credit, it can also be your spiritual master/in fact it is not different in principle from the stage of sadhana in bhakti, but the quality is different. It will prepare you to actually acting selflessly for the true pleasure of the Absolute Truth.

Now in the spiritual world there is no material nature that will be the doer of karma, there is no sadhana progress that you perform thus there is no need to credit your akarma actions to the worshipable deity. So when on the level of saksad darsana you will realize that it is you, the soul, is the knower and the doer, as stated in the sruti. Esa hi drasta srasta (Prasna Upanisad 4.9) However there is no problem with misidentification and karma as I said at that level, and in fact it is your natural position, the illusion is when you superimpose that on "your" material body. You can however if you are in a particular mood, experience doubling results by submissive service to the ista-devata, and that may mean She is the doer and you are the surrendered servitor. In any case you should not identify with called conditioning and to overcome it you need to always give credit to those who are taking care of you and God, do not think your mind and body are the doer, but act for the pleasure of Krishna.

> For a soul attaining liberation via karma yoga the question who is the doer-the living entity, material nature or Krsna as Paramatma- is answered > in Bg. 5.13-15 (soul is not a doer Gita repeats the word "na" three times (na kartrtvam na karmani na karma-phala-samyogam) , material nature > is the doer and Krishna controls the nature but is not the doer and God does not accept any reactions (karma)). In this way one can do akarma
> on the karma-yoga path.

Your conclusion that material nature is the doer is incorrect. As per Baladeva Vidhyabhushanas Govinda-bhasya, because material nature is insentient it is never the doer. The soul is always the doer in both the liberated condition and the bound condition.

deena:]>

Your conclusion that material nature is the doer is incorrect. As per Baladeva Vidhyabhushanas Govinda-bhasya, because material nature is insentient it is never the doer. The soul is always the doer in both the liberated condition and the bound condition.[/quote]

The conclusion of BV is about it is an interesting issue, for example he quotes the upanisadic conclusion of the Prasna Upanisad (4.9) it is said: esa hi drasta sprasta srota rasayita ghrata manta boddha karta vijnanatma purusah

"The individual spirit soul is the seer, the toucher, the hearer, the taster, the smeller, the thinker, the determiner, the doer, and the knower."

And concludes that : This truth is accepted because it is declared by scripture, not because it is understood by logic. Our acceptance of the truth of scripture is described in sutra 2.1.27, --- The individual spirit soul is both knowledge and knower.

Later he bring up this key verse:

In the Bhagavad-gita (13.21) it is also said:

karya-karana-kartrtve
hatuh prakrtir ucyate
purusah sukha-duhkhanam
bhoktrtve hetur ucyate

"Nature is said to be the cause of all material causes and effects, whereas the living entity is the cause of the various sufferings and enjoyments in this world."*
Therefore the individual spirit soul does not perform actions. When a person understands the truth he understands that all actions are actually performed by the material energy and the individual spirit soul is merely the person who experiences the fruits of action.

Now that is in contradiction is int it? (Apparently)
then he looks at the next sutra and says: In the following words the author of the sutras gives the proper conclusion.

VS - 31

karta sastrarthavat-tvat

karta-the doer; sastra-of the scriptures; artha-meaning; vat-possessing; tvat-because of having the nature.

He performs actions. This is so because the scriptures are meaningful.

And Baladeva Vidyabhusana states:

It is the individual spirit soul who performs actions, not the modes of material nature. Why is that? The sutra explains: "Because the scriptures are meaningful." In the scriptures it is said:

svarga-kamo yajeta

"A person who desires Svargaloka should perform yajnas."

and

atmanam eva lokam upasita

"One should worship the Supreme Personality of Godhead."

These statements have meaning only if the individual spirit soul does actually perform actions. If all actions are performed by the modes of nature and the individual spirit soul never does anything, these statements of the scriptures are meaningless. These statements of scripture are intended to motivate the individual spirit soul to act in a certain way so he can enjoy the results of his actions. It is not even possible in this way to try to motivate the inert material modes to act in any way at all.

Again the same conclusion as what I said, if you understand what he had said.

Basically person who is in illusion thinks that he (the body or the mind) is the doer. And that is wrong, specifically if you strive to perform akama or niskama, and in fact is wrong for any conditioned soul, it is the illusion.

The situation is rather different for a pure devotee soul that plays with the Lord, in action that has nothing to do with three modes of nature, (true action).

In Vedanta Syamantaka same Baladeva Vidyabhusana makes another point:

The individual spirit souls is a performer of activities. He perceives the sense objects. He enjoys pleasures. In the Sruti-sastra it is said:
"The individual spirit soul acquires knowledge. He performs yajnas. He performs activities."
In the Sruti-sastra it is also said:
"The individual spirit souls enjoys what he desires."
Some philosophers think, `The individual spirit soul is the highest doer, the highest knower, the highest enjoyer. This idea is a foolish mistake. The Supreme Personality of Godhead alone is the highest doer, knower and enjoyer. In Mahabharata, Vana-parva, Yamaraja tells Maharaja Somaka:
"The Supreme Personality of Godhead is alone the highest doer, knower, and enjoyer. No one else ever becomes a doer, knower, or enjoyer like Him."

8 Here someone may protest: Activities always bring sufferings, and therefore it is not possible for any spiritual being to be a doer of activities. That is the message of the Sruti-sastra."
To this I reply: it is not as you think. Material activities, like the darsa and paurnamasa yajnas, are certainly troublesome. But the spiritual pastimes of the Lord and His associates never bring trouble or suffering.

==
The important bit is his own words of critique of what is his own conclusion (or interpretation of it):

Some philosophers think, `The individual spirit soul is the highest doer, the highest knower, the highest enjoyer. This idea is a foolish mistake. The Supreme Personality of Godhead alone is the highest doer, knower and enjoyer... And the way he contrasts the activities of this world of suffering with Krishnas pastimes.

I do not think he will at any point contradict SB 12.10.31-32 , where it is describing that the three gunas appear as if the doer, but actually they are all acting as per His desire, as if it is His dream. (karta iva-as if the doer; svapna-drk-a person who is seeing a dream)

Now to think that three modes of nature are actual doers of material action in the material world working under direction is not contradicting the fact that the soul (when in the world) should not think himself the doer of karma, and yet again the doer, when it comes to what he describes as " the spiritual pastimes of the Lord and His associates [that are] never bring trouble or suffering." So one needs to distingush the avisuddha kartuh--the doer who is not purified (not KC) and suddhah kartuh. By its nature in the original state soul is the doer, not a conditioned soul, that one is completely bound up and the only action that it can do, is to one day decide to wake up, by the mercy of a devotee or Krishna. Then the action begins.

This is concluded in Paramatma sandarbha, 29.

parabhidhyanena prakrty-avesena prakrtir evaham iti mananena prakrter gunaih kriyamanesu karmasu kartrtvam atmani manyate. atra niraham-bhavasya parabhidhyanasambhavat paravesa-jatahankarasya cavarakatvad asty eva tasminn anyo ham-bhava-visesah. sa ca suddha-rupa-matra-nisthatvan na samsara-hetur iti spastam

Here the world "parabhidhyanena" means "by entering the material world and thinking `I am made of matter." In this way the transcendental living entity accepts the influence of material energy as his field of activities, and thus actuated, he wrongly applies the activities to himself (prakrter gunair kriyamanesu karmasu kartrtvam atmani manyate). A person who is free of false-ego does not think in this way. Only when a person is covered by materialistic false-ego does he think in this way. A soul who is convinced of his spiritual identity has no reason to enter the material world. That is clear.

(that last bit "spastam - clear" can be discussed further=) Now understanding the concept of who is the actual doer is not a theoretical thing.

The question is "How am I not the doer?"

The simple answer, using Baladev Vishyabhuasanas simple analogy in his Govinda-bhasya, is of the carpenter. When a carpenter creates something, he is the doer in the sense that he uses and directs his tools to create the item. He is not the doer in the sense that it is the tools that do the physical creating of the item.

And another explanation he gives is that sastra repeats that material nature is the doer because one should not think himself the only doer. Thank you deena:

" These words explain the scripture passages that declare the modes of nature to be the performers of action. It is foolish for a person to think himself the sole performer of action and ignore the five factors of action. Of course it is not that the individual spirit soul never performs any action. The idea that the soul never does anything is clearly refuted by the many scriptural statements urging the soul to act such a way that he may attain liberation. "

Out of five factors of action Paramatma is the ultimate factor, The ultimacy of the Paramatmas influence on all action is confirmed elsewhere in the Gita (Bg. 15.15, 18.61). This is also supported by Vedanta-sutra 2.3.41. Ramanujacarya describes the Paramatma as "the most important element in determining the results of any action."

Krishna in the Gita sometimes takes one side of this issue and sometimes the other. At times He wants to emphasize our position as tiny souls who should not be falsely proud of our prowess or think ourselves rightfully attached to the fruits of our activities. At such times, He emphasizes that we are not the doer, that we do not cause the fruits of our activities and that the results of our activities are awarded to us by material nature. At other times, He emphasizes our culpability. He then wants us to take full responsibility for our actions and their reactions. Thus, at those times, Krishna stresses Himself also as the non-doer.

Paramatma, the material nature and the living entities are all doers. The reasons (in debate with nastikas) for Vedanta sutras accretion are explained in tikas to Bhag. 10.87.25, when you are in argument with someone the main reason is to defeat the opponent, who in this case claims the monistic theory of illusion and oneness of a passive soul (ie the soul never does anything) . Although the living entity is not the ultimate doer, he still remains responsible for his actions and their results as long as his actions spring from his desire to bahirmukh -- to turn away from God/.