Pariprashnena — Q&A Archive

Many Jews are quite secularized. If you want a profound answer, ask this question at some Jewish theology forum.

I asked about the Vedic perspective on this ...

Yes I heard a translation of a Jewish mass sometime ago and I have to say I was somewhat shocked by the words. Basically the mass upheld the notion that all Jewish people are gods only chosen ones and therefore all other people and religions were lower than or subservient to the Jews and because of their suffering all of humanity was in debt to the Jewish community.

There is nothing worse than a person or group who think they have god on their side..I guess there are many groups like that (chuckles). When God is on your side you can do anything, even kill your enemies. All of the major religions, including Hinduism and Gaudiya Vaisnavas are guilty of this. Its a dangerous cocktail mixing God, institutional politics and the false ego together..more explosive than TNT.

But it seems in the modern age the Jewish community especially in Israel have decided to flip the coin, unfortunately all that tapas (austerity performed) has only resulted in the Jews becoming like their enemies (eager to inflict pain and suffering on others). Maybe thats what happens when you hate too much you become like your enemies.

As far as a vedic perspective on these issues one could take in MahaBharata/Bhagavad Gita, in vedic times all non-violent efforts were completey exhausted before considering war. In these times, any excuse is good enough to attack (including weapons of mass destruction that dont exist) they seem to want to exhaust all weapons and expenditure before they will consider non-violent discussion or they will hold a discussion/peace talks while war is still going on. Then at the end of the peace talks of which they will declare were completely successful and yet the war will continue on as if the peace talks were completely irrelevant.

Heh!...The crazy days of Kali Yuga.

I dont know much about Jewish understanding of God (therere various Jewish groups with different approaches) and how the Jews explain Shoa. So without this I cant come up with a relevant Vedic perspective.

One can understand the Jewish worldview - esp. how they see their enemies - from the book By Way of Deception from Victor Ostrovsky.

There is not much we can know about Jewish understanding of god from Vedic perspective, since it is not Vedic perspective. Maybe ask Steven Rosen (Satyaraja Prabhu). He studied the subject really well. "Om Shalom: Judaism and Krishna Consciousness" is his book. Certainly there is such a wast difference between different expressions of faith, especially by materialistic followers of religion. The only other religion that I know, where you can say anything if you have a "quote" is Hinduism, (now how much you want to modify the quote to suite your own ideas is rather alarming). Prabhupada was complaining that as soon as one has a new idea, first thing one does in India, is to write a commentary on Bhagavad Gita... (or become a rabbi if outside of India;0)

Similar to that book is: http://www.veda.harekrsna.cz/library/Rabbi_and_I.zip
Nothing about Holocaust though.

A curious info about Holocaust being predicted in the Bible and related reincarnation of 10 sons of Biblical Haman as Nazi leaders:

EL HOLOCAUSTO NAZI PREDICHO POR LA BIBLIA
http://www.ortiznava.com/2009/01/el-pueblo-hebreo/

Now just to be very clear. Nor in Judaism nor in Hinduism God is not the maker of Holocaust, nor is he responsible for actions and reactions of individual jivas. Just to be sure it is clear. We are not puppets (both in conditioned state and if we understand that we are not this body).

[quote][cite] ccd:[/cite]There is not much we can know about Jewish understanding of god from Vedic perspective, since it is not Vedic perspective.[/quote]

I thought one could talk about everything from the Vedic perspective?[br][br]

But perhaps this is where my understanding is lacking?[br]
Because I tend to think "If I know the Vedic scriptures, then I should and will be able to explain everything."[br][br]

[quote]Maybe ask Steven Rosen (Satyaraja Prabhu). He studied the subject really well. "Om Shalom: Judaism and Krishna Consciousness" is his book.[/quote]

Thank you for the suggestion. I am not so much interested in the Jews per se, but the Jewish situation just strikes me as an extreme example of something that can readily be found among theists - such as Christians lamenting at the funerals of their relatives, cursing God and such.[br][br]

[quote]Certainly there is such a wast difference between different expressions of faith, especially by [b]materialistic[/b] followers of religion.[/quote]

This is what I have ben trying to get at - that on the whole, the Jewish reaction seems materialistic somehow. I just cant get my mind around to understand how someone can say "I believe in God" and then ask questions like "Why does God allow evil to happen?"[br][br]

[quote]The only other religion that I know, where you can say anything if you have a "quote" is Hinduism, (now how much you want to modify the quote to suite your own ideas is rather alarming). Prabhupada was complaining that as soon as one has a new idea, first thing one does in India, is to write a commentary on Bhagavad Gita... (or become a rabbi if outside of India;0)[/quote]

I was just reading in the Introduction to Suhotra Swamis Transcendental Personalism where he brings this up - how do we know that some scriptural passage really supports an opinion of ours. This reminds me of how the Bible has been used to support all kinds of things - e.g. both the proponents and the opponents of the capital punishment can use Biblical verses to support their position.[br]
But here I wonder about how to read scriptures and what to do with them.

[quote][cite] Baker:[/cite][quote][cite] ccd:[/cite]There is not much we can know about Jewish understanding of god from Vedic perspective, since it is not Vedic perspective.[/quote]

I thought one could talk about everything from the Vedic perspective?[br][br][/quote]
It is only funny if you want to explain someones beliefs to them from Vedic point of view without knowing what they are. Yes the problem is vivid materialism in a spiritual tradition. Actual spiritual religion is very easy corruptible. Again explained in the second verse of the Bhagavatam. Here is a little thing from Satyaraja who knows what he is talking about.

[quote][cite] ccd:[/cite]It is only funny if you want to explain someones beliefs to them from Vedic point of view without knowing what they are.[/quote]

I meant that the Vedic perspective is so superior and so all-encompassing that everything can be properly analyzed and explained from it, with no gaps, contradictions and gray areas.[br][br]

[quote]Actual spiritual religion is very easy corruptible. Again explained in the second verse of the Bhagavatam.[/quote]

I am not sure I understand. Do you mean SB 1.1.2? Perhaps I have read and understood poorly, but from that verse, I didnt take that actual spiritual religion would be easily corruptible.[br]

Perhaps it is some kind of magic thinking on my part, but I do tend to think that just saying the word "God" prevents the person from uttering some falsehood or something lowly. This is what I retained from Catholic sermons I have heard early in my life. But I do get confused easily in this regard ...
[br][br]

[quote]Here is a little thing from Satyaraja who knows what he is talking about.[/quote]

Thank you for the documents. I am already familiar with some of Satyarajas writings, like his explanation of the four regulative principles and his discussion with a Christian priest (who was much more submissive and willing to concede than the rabbi!).
[br][br]
From what I have read in the documents you sent, it appears the Jews are strongly focused on right and wrong, what God permitted and what forbidden, they seem very legalistic, as if keeping the laws would be the highest spiritual conception.[br]
I find it difficult to understand what a religious tradition is about merely from reading the writings of that traditions; contrasting discussions are usually a lot more revealing.

> contrasting discussions are usually a lot more revealing.

When one knows discussed traditions well. Otherwise such discussion may confuse one even more. From my observation, a great number of followers of any tradition isnt ready (and even interested) in full-fledged interfaith exchanges. This requires one to be on the level of madhyama adhikari.

True Veda. Interfaith is such a big word, but who can actually do it?

[quote][cite] VEDA:[/cite]When one knows discussed traditions well. Otherwise such discussion may confuse one even more. From my observation, a great number of followers of any tradition isnt ready (and even interested) in full-fledged interfaith exchanges. This requires one to be on the level of madhyama adhikari.[/quote]

Actually, I am not interested in interfaith exchanges per se (although for college purposes, I have to educate myself on this matter as well). I am drawn and quite consciously take to situations where there is a contrast of at least two positions. I dont like quarreling, but an intelligent debate is something I find appealing in and of itself.

[quote][cite] ccd:[/cite]True Veda. Interfaith is such a big word, but who can actually do it?[/quote]

Those who have the competences (knowledge, socio-political position) and opportunity to do so ...[br]
[br]

I would still like to know whether you were referring to SB 1.1.2 earlier. Thank you.

[quote][cite] Baker:[/cite][quote][cite] ccd:[/cite]True Veda. Interfaith is such a big word, but who can actually do it?[/quote]

[br]

I would still like to know whether you were referring to SB 1.1.2 earlier. Thank you.[/quote] Yes I was referring to this verse. Sorry.