Pariprashnena — Q&A Archive

This could be taken as a request for us just to accept Krishna blessings which are readily available for all.

For example it can be sunny outside but you must ready to go outside to get the benefit of the sunny weather

Yes. Theres the famous man in the well example. When the rescuers throw him a rope, he has to grab it to be pulled out.

In the examples with the sunshine and being caught in the well, at least one has some idea that one is probably going to a better place than one is currently at.

This better future can be ascertained by accounts of sastras and death bed visions of sattvic persons.

That was for those persons.
What hope can I have??
An eternity of being patronized, betrayed and yelled at?

No, it is available to those who visit a hospice. One can ask the staff about their experiences and have some on ones own.

Associating with devotees has been one of the worst experiences of my life.
Of course, you will all just blame me. That I have not tried hard enough and such. Even heroin addicts use that same argument.
Two and a half years of efforts - and for what?? For nothing and absolutely nothing but misery.
Two and a half years of gritting my teeth and bearing it.
Two and a half years of telling myself "Oh, it must be that this is so elevated, since I dont understand it."

it can be only three things, that you have not encountered ONE devotee worth asociating with:

1. there is none in you area.
2. you are not understanding
3. you have a general relationship problem

#1 try harder and pray to Krishna, we only have to have 1 friend in KC.
#2 please pursue other venues, dont force yourself, your path is still other before you come to KC (and there is no harm in this, just natural evolution).
#3 get counsel from a trusted person

> Of course, you will all just blame me.

I wont. The options I see are:

1. You are completely to blame.
2. You and your devotee associates more or less share the blame.
3. Your devotee associates are completely to blame.

Personally, I can never in good conscience accept #3 as an option. Even if I find myself in the bad or compromised devotee association, if I dont do anything about it then there is only me to blame for that. Many devotees have written extensively on this point, which revolves around the fear of rejection, isolation and breaking from the herd.

It seems to me baker, we again come to a recurring psychological dynamic I see in many of your posts : smart enough to see through it, too scared to do anything about it.

I am not saying I am innocent in all this.
I just feel physically ill from it all.

I went there with good intentions, hoping that I would learn something there. And I got yelled at, and nobody did anything. They just let it happen. And they are "spiritual".

With devotees, am I supposed to apply the same kind of psychology and guarding as one would with members of a street gang? Is this what it has come to.

Although I have heard things have changed there since I left. Not much seemed to have been happening at that group for years, and then within a few months, a brahmana moved to the city with his family, also another couple of initiated devotees, the mataji I was having such problems with moved to a different city so she rarely comes, and the loud devotee had two brain strokes.

This sounds like theres a brighter future ahead for that group.

> I just feel physically ill from it all.

What more evidence do you want?

could easily be a mixture of all inebrieties... but I can understand your experience has not been very encouraging to say the least. Almost everything is cured by GOOD association, except profound dumbness which happily you are not showing :) Keep looking but stay far away from bitter and harsh people.

With Iskcon Temples I make it a point of not getting too close regardless of any changes, there is very little bhakti left, how could there be when so many pujaris and temple presidents are doing it for a wage, at my local Iskcon scene money is constantly misappropriated by the leader, between that and all the wages and salaries that are paid out there is very little left. They have turned the Free Sunday Feast into a business and it tastes nothing like prasadam, so busy taking all of Srila Prabhupadas money. Because of this there is always politics, fighting, yelling, anger and hatred because peoples enjoying propensities are always in threat, even police are called in to sort out disputes over power with threats of violence, what a sham this has become.

True devotional life is meant to remove the anarthas from ones heart not install them. Yes most people I know can only relate bad experiences from their involvement with Iskcon and this usually is the period after Srila Prabhupada left the planet. If I visit an Iskcon Temple it is only to take darshan of the dieties anything more than that and I find the highly charged mood of politics, money and power starts to bear down on you.

I will seek my sadhu sanga elsewhere, who ever heard of a sadhu taking a wage anyway? As Srila Prabhupada used to say the proof is in the pudding, and when Srila Prabhupada was here one taste of the pudding turned a person from a yavana into a devotee, but now the pudding just doesnt taste the same.

Of course it goes without saying the mood in any ashram/temple is dependent on the devotees, some Iskcon centres may be operating very nicely due to the attitude and behaviour of the residing devotees while for others it may not be the same.

Which temple you speak about? (To be avoided.) Is the GBC aware of the situation?

Wages are OT. Comments belong here: http://www.pariprashnena.com/discussion/579/if-you-are-being-paid-can-you-call-it-devotional-service/

Thank you all for your support.

I swear I am not bipolar, but somehow, I have these characteristic and confusing ups and downs.
Slowly, I become depressed, and then it goes down, and I become really angry and worried about Krishna consciousness and life in general - and then, when I reach the tip, I suddenly get some amazing insight or something really nice happens.
Yesterday, I was in tears when I was writing here, and then a little later, a very nice devotee sent me a link to a video that is the absolutely nicest Krishna conscious experience I have ever had.
(Of course I then felt bad for all the mean things I have said here.)

Thats KC. When were down, Krsna helps. :)

link to the nice KC video? We all have those days.... :)

No, this is just for me, at least for the time being. :)

Krishna conciousness is not artificial imposition,the problem is us,our hearts are extremely polluted,also we can realistically only accept krishna from another devotee .Hence the extreme neccesity of serving personally older devotees, and receiving there mercy by submissive inquiries.This is not an interlectual process ,one cannot storm the gates through ones intelligence or any other means.Submission and service are rudimentary and essential to appreciate krishnas sublime mercy within the gaudiya lineage!

Myself it has been my experience that krishna prasadam blessed by the senior devotees and shared with them is the fastest approach for neophytes .Many a time the obstacles i face have literally dissolved, by honouring prasadam cooked and served to me by these great souls.Hence i am made worthy to approach krishna through my submission and literally there blessings .Tadiyanam suracara nam...those things in connection with krishna ,are most pleasing to him!

Yes, thats it. My siksa guru said that drinking caranamrta is a prevention from giving up KC.

[quote][cite] deena:[/cite]Personally, I can never in good conscience accept #3 as an option. Even if I find myself in the bad or compromised devotee association, if I dont do anything about it then there is only me to blame for that. Many devotees have written extensively on this point, which revolves around the fear of rejection, isolation and breaking from the herd.[/quote]

Could you please provide some authors/titles of these writings?