Pariprashnena — Q&A Archive

Pure devotees are obviously not under karma.
Other devotees are under Krishna karma, which is the Lord taking personal care of the aspiring devotee, modelling her/his karma to advance in KC.
quote:
"To show them special mercy, I, dwelling in their hearts, destroy with the shining lamp of knowledge the darkness born of ignorance." Bhagavad Gita 10.11

"Devotee" is a very broad term. Mahaprabhu answered the question of "who is a devotee" three different ways on different occasions, including stating that "anyone who utters the name of Krishna even once is a devotee".

My understanding is that as one becomes progressively purified of their misidentification as the controller and enjoyer of the material energy (isvaro ham aham bhogi), and situated in their identity as a servant of Krishna (jivera svarupa haya, krsnera nitya dasa), they are less and less affected by karma.

The issue of the destruction of karma is dealt with extensively in the Nectar of Devotion, chapter 1. Different types of karma, such as prarabdha (manifest) and bhija (unmanifested) are discussed, and the order in which they are destroyed is also discussed.

Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 6 chapter 1 discusses prayascitta, or atonement, and describes how it destroys unmanifested reactions in the future, but does not address the seed karma that gives rise to sinful actions in this life. There it is described that devotional service, on the other hand, will destroy not only the future reactions, but also the seeds that give rise to improper action.

Srimad Bhagavatam 11.14.19 states: "My dear Uddhava, just as a blazing fire turns firewood into ashes, similarly, devotion unto Me completely burns to ashes sins committed by My devotees."

Anyway, its proportional to actual devotional service and purification of consciousness, not by simply applying a label: "devotee".

So the fact is that "devotional service destroys karma in its different forms", not that devotees are or are not under the law of karma. Because you can define "devotee" in different ways, and being under the law of karma doesnt really map to the conceptual framework that is used in these descriptions of how it works. its not black and white, "flip the switch" - its like water washing onto the beach, sometimes the beach is covered, sometimes not. As the tide goes out, the water washes over the sand less and less, until finally it is dry and uncovered. Similarly the exit of the living entity, the tatashta-sakti, from the external energy to the internal energy is like that.

Bhagavad-gita 9.13 describes those perfected personalities who have attained full shelter of devotional service:

"O son of Pr?th?, those who are not deluded, the great souls, are under the protection of the divine nature. They are fully engaged in devotional service because they know Me as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, original and inexhaustible."

They are fully engaged, and thus under the protection of the divine nature. Inasmuch as you are not engaged in devotional service, or that is to say as much as your actions are contaminated by a false conception of the self and the world (even while youre doing "service"), you are under the "protection" of the external energy, which generates karma for you.

What scares me a little is when someone thinks can do anything and everything cause not under the law of karma, under the plea of being a devotee.
It makes more sense that one is not a pure devotee is still under karma, but Krishna takes special care to help she/he advance in Krishna consciousness

nice comment meme.

Some so called devotees think they are even beyond morality because they are devotees.
Strange how this mentality develops...

BVPM once said that if you are chanting and following regulative principles you are not under the laws of karma anymore BUT because you are still keeping your old conditioning, you are still identifying with your false ego, Krsna sends his mercy so you can purify your heart.

I hope it was something like that. I heard this lecture long long time ago but it makes sense :)

"BVPM once said that if you are chanting and following regulative principles you are not under the laws of karma"

That is not accurate, while being mixed devotees we are under the modes,

what is special about following Krishna is that He moves the chess in amazing and particular ways to help you one day be pure and karma-less. That is more complex and more difficult to explain, so sometimes some lazy preachers resort to the "publicity tricks" to atract customers.

It is not so easy to become free of the modes and karma, rules and regulations are just a (necessary) stepping stone towards pure devotion. We like to think ourselves as pure devotees because somehow we are managing to follow sadhana, etc But history shows us how many staunch followers of rules have being laid out the path.

Krishna is always there for you and would do anything to have you back... loving father He is.