Pariprashnena — Q&A Archive

I count 21 questions directly related and many many places in this website.
The word "Prabhupada" appears a total of 816 times in our database, so far.
In fact all this site is revolving around Srila Prabhupadas instruction about discussing the philosophy "from all angles of vision"
Nice example:
http://www.pariprashnena.com/discussion/287/all-glories-to-srila-prabhupada/
Use the search button please...

The initial intention of this site may be as you say, "revolving around Prabhupadas instruction about discussing the philosophy from all angles of vision. However, when one browses through the "discussions" that take place on this site it becomes quite obvious that no-one is glorifying Prabhupada. Instead, everyone makes his or her own interpretations of multi-various topics based on Vedic injunctions outside the scope of Prabhupadas books. Your one example of All glories to Srila Prabhupada hardly constitutes glorification. Two people responded. In fact, I myself responded to it this morning. You deleted it. Why? All I said was "Ki-J, Wow. A Prabhupada man". I was actually amazed to see that at least one person was making an attempt to glorify Srila Prabhupada. Otherwise, all I have seen thus far for the most part, is personal interpretations of scripture and opinions. No-one is saying Prabhupada said this, that, or the other. No. Instead, you say, "in my opinion" or, It says this or that in this Veda or that Veda. These so-called discussions that allegedly revolve around Prabhupadas instructions are a farce. Everyone is putting forth his own opinions and interpretations, or views from his own experience. What is the value of our interpretations, experiences and opinions? Better still, what are the positive results they produce? None. How could they? Many persons that frequent this site for help are obviously not getting it. Prabhupada used to say, "We judge by the results". What are the positive results of all this discussion? I have never seen anyone on this site refer someone to Srila Prabhupadas books for the answers to their questions. Or say, just take shelter of Srila Prabhupadas books for they are non-different then Prabhupada Himself. Instead, you make your own personal comments or quote some scripture. This is irresponsible for Prabhupadas disciples not to direct them to the authority. It has no real benefit because you are assuming the authority. No-one is directing the young people on this site to Prabhupada for answers to their many questions. Furthermore, how are these discussions glorifying Prabhupada? Our points of view are ultimately flawed, whereas Prabhupadas are flawless. This is the problem. We are so puffed up that we are thinking that anything what we have to say has some significance. If your not quoting Prabhupada directly, you are speculating. And if you are quoting from the shastras outside the realm of Prabhupadas books, you are not following the instructions of Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada never told us to study the Vedas. There may have been some specific instructions to some specific devotees regarding study of the Vedas, but for the most part, this was not Prabhupadas instruction. He clearly states that in the letter posted above. As I said previously, your one posting with two responses of "All glories to Srila Prabhupada" hardly constitutes the glorification of Him.

You probably have some reasons to say what you say about Prabhupadas books, but your coming and happily dismantling the days, or probably weeks of service instilled in this site by the admins and users, disqualifies you as a judge in my view.
Your opinion that this site isnt useful doesnt give you the rights to give the sauce like this. It is just your opinion and, who are you, anyway?

Firstly, peterjiu when you say," You probably have some reasons to say what you say about Prabhupadas books". What exactly do you mean by that statement? Did I say something out of line regarding Prabhupadas books? Secondly, what makes you think you know what my inner most motives are referencing that I am; "happily dismantling" as you say, the days and weeks of service instilled in this site. Actually it saddens me to even have to point out such a thing. Furthermore, you put words in my mouth by implying that I feel the site isnt useful. I never said that. As far as giving the sauce; preachers are similar to physicians in that, when they see another physician giving the wrong advice, the observing physician is duty bound to inform the patient. Last but certainly not least, "Who are you anyway"? I am a humble disciple of Srila Prabhupada trying to serve him to the best of my ability. Who are you peter?

[quote][cite] Priyavrata das:[/cite]Furthermore, you put words in my mouth by implying that I feel the site isnt useful. I never said that. As far as giving the sauce; preachers are similar to physicians in that, when they see another physician giving the wrong advice, the observing physician is duty bound to inform the patient.[/quote]
[quote][cite] Priyavrata das:[/cite]These so-called discussions that allegedly revolve around Prabhupadas instructions are a farce. Everyone is putting forth his own opinions and interpretations, or views from his own experience. What is the value of our interpretations, experiences and opinions? Better still, what are the positive results they produce? None. How could they? Many persons that frequent this site for help are obviously not getting it. [/quote]

Your assumption that all personal commentaries by devotees are "speculation" is over the board and probably not very good for your spiritual life.
Please do not use the knife-surgeon example, that I heard in the early 80s and its not relevant in todays context, not with people with some brain, anyway.
And, Prabhupada disciple, show that in your kind posts of help and encouragement (and humbleness). You are the one with the qualities, not me.

We are going to close this question as it is probably not very much "Prabhupada centered" by now :)

To Priyavrata:

We, as admins have read ALL the questions and answers of this site from the very beginning and we encourage you to do the same, to help make this our common effort more Srila Prabhupada centered.

Please participate, give ideas and correct any philosophical mistakes you can spot as being Prabhupada "astraying". We do what we can, really.

Regarding your personal doubts about the usefulness of this service, we can post a question to get some feedback, (at least of the registered users) and we will act from there.

Nobody wants to lose their valuable time, neither the admins here.

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Some data from pariprashnena.com using a 5 minutes non extensive
regular site search:

Conversations with direct "Srila Prabhupada books" quotes found:

-113 "Bhagavad gita As It Is" quotes
-70 "Bhagavatam" quotes
-14 "Nectar of Devotion"
-12 "Nectar of Instruction" quotes
-5 "Krishna book" quotes

***********************************************************************

Yes, peterji, you have thus revealed to everyone you true envious nature, and how puffed up you really are. The truth is a tough pill to swallow. How could YOU possibly know what is good for my spiritual life, when its obvious that you dont even know what is good for your own based on your words so far. In any event, whats your real beef? Its apparent that there is some underlying reason for the lashing out. Spill it.

Dear admin,
your right. Please allow me to elaborate.

I actually feel that all of you there at admin intended to provide a nice service to Srila Prabhupada thru this site. It just struck me as a little strange that this was occurring. I was told by someone that this would be a nice site for me to visit and perhaps have some opportunity to present some positive input, meaning, simply refer everyone to Prabhupada and what we were taught by Him. Otherwise we are guilty of self glorification. If we actually want to glorify Srila Prabhupada, why object to the observation. If you were offended by my comments, please accept my apologies. My intention was certainly not to offend. However, I must admit, I didnt take offense into consideration. I just know that if we try to glorify Srila Prabhupada as much as possible, in every way possible, our endeavors will be successful. I will take the liberty in thinking that our endeavors are the same. Bring everyone to the authority, Srila Prabhupada. What else can we possibly do?

With your permission, as you are the one that opened the question, I think we must delete this unfortunate thread.

Priyavrata Prabhu, let me suggest you to contact Visnu Murti P. (vaniseva at pamho.net) who is looking for devotees to participate in his Vanipedia project: http://vanipedia.org/wiki/

I dont understand. First of all, why is this thread unfortunate? I am simply making an honest observation. I have already explained my intentions and have apologized for any offense that anybody may have taken to my comments regarding the issue. As offending was not my intention. Why is the very presence of this question becoming problematic. Am I out of line? If so prabhus, please tell me how so and I will take it under advisement. I appreciate you asking my permission to delete. However, let us see how this plays out. I will maintain my composure during its course. Let us see what other users have to say.

Dear Veda prabhu, p a m h o. Thank you for the advice, I will certainly look into that. While I have your attention prabhu, your comments and answers to questions throughout the site continue to astound me. I would like to comment on a previous statement you made regarding Ritvik Initiations being bogus as well as other topics in the spiritual realm that are discussed here. If you would rather we speak to each other in a more private setting, for fear of causing a disturbance, ask admin for my address. I dont want to cause any disturbance. Your servant, Priyavrata das

O.K.

Dear Priyavrata das

You should check out my posts I dont know what I am talking about at all : )

Anyway why dont you tell us about Glorifying Srila Prabhupada, Im up for that.

I cant say that there has been any of it in this thread so far, even by you. That is not a criticism mind you, it is an honest observation. I am always a bit concerned when people mask their impetous to critisize by saying they were just being honest. Its an extremely common thing that. Honesty is no excuse for being rude. As far as I am concerned your behaviour so far can leaves much to be desired.

I expect that you come here to discuss things of interest to you and things which may uplift us all, most people here are after that am sure, and I am definitely up for that.

So lets start with glorifying. I always like to seek clarity, words are tricky things arent they, especially on the Internet. We type them on our keyboard and next thing you know they are on the web and they can often seem to mean something else altogether.

So firstly can you say what you mean by Glorifying Srila Prabhupada in the context of this online forum. I am serious, I am not "having a go at you" as they say where I come from.

Secondly I like to discuss things properly so some reference that this behaviour is appropriate would be good for me. We should do it because...? Again I am serious, I am not pulling your leg, I think your initial idea is not a bad one, its actually a good one. I want to learn about it so please help me with those two small things to start off with.

1 your definition of glorification or glorifying ( to make sure we are on the same page)
2 Some reference from the Gita perhaps or Srimad Bhagavatam that might give us a grounding in this.

oh and are you the Priyavrata das from Food For Life?

I sincerely await your earliest reply

Dear abrennan,
obeisance at your feet . All glories to Srila Prabhupada. Yes, I have seen your posts and I agree with you. :):):) No, just teasing prabhu. Your words seem to be those of an intelligent man therefore, I will not attempt to pull any punches with you as they say where I come from. My mask is not one of criticism but of concern. My approach to the question at hand may have been a bit rude and I did apologise for that. If you choose not to accept, that is your business. However, the unintended rude approach is simply a display of my intense passion for keeping Srila Prabhupada in the center of everything. So please excuse me for that. Its very frustrating to constantly see and hear so-called devotees of Prabhupada pontificate on their own behalf. Without the mercy of Srila Prabhupada you and I wouldnt be having this discussion right now. Instead, we would be in the living hell of the karmi world life after life forever like everyone else. Living without Prabhupada. Living without Krsna. Could you imagine such a thing. I dread to do so. In any event, thats my definition of glorification. Webster defines it as; "to make glorious by bestowing honor, praise or admiration, to elevate to celestial glory, to represent as glorious, glory to as in worship". Can you honestly say that these definitions are taking place here regarding Srila Prabhupada?
Yes, words are tricky things Bubba, so let us not play games. Because I too am serious. Regarding referencing; thats an absurd request. Prabhupada said so many times in so many places, to so many devotees and others as well; "My only qualification is that I am simply repeating like a parrot what I have heard from my Guru Maharaja. Otherwise I have no personal qualification". He also said; "I am simply trying to fulfil the orders of my spiritual master". That was Prabhupadas greatness. Out of all His godbrothers, He alone took up the orders of His Guru-Maharaja. Thats what elevated Him to His position. He made these statements many, many times, in many many places, like His books, classes, lectures, discussions, everywhere. He constantly and consistently glorified His Guru Maharaja. He never accepted any credit for any of His many great accomplishments nor anything else for that matter. Thats the glorification Im speaking of. I hope that answers your questions.
Your servant,
Priyavrata das

P.S. No not that Priyavrata

Dear Pryavrata

Please accept my humble obeisances
ALL GLORIES TO SRILA PRABHUPADA

I took out the line about your apology that wasnt fair on you

but as for the rest

although I get the gist of what you are saying if you are unwilling to provide any reference that is pretty appalling considering you are discussing with someone who admits they dont know and would like to know. I would request that you work on the ability to engage people and transmit information to them rather than beating them about the head and demanding they accept your word.

Its like this. I have read everything I can get my hands on and have not once come across anything that describes Srila Prabhupada asking for glorification. Infact, as you say yourself, it is quite the opposite. He is humble and refuses to accept the responsibility for anything.

So I if you want to discuss it I do also, but I cannot accept your word for anything. I dont know you, you are not here, you could be telling me anything. There is no basis for me to belive you. That is why if you are serious you will provide references to support your claims.

So come on mate, inform me, dont blow me off with some line that is absurd that you should substantiate yourself. What is absurd is that you start this thread and then wont substantiate your claims.

The things is that I want to know and you could tell me but you wont, where does that leave me?

So come on, reveal your quality, tell me where I can find this information in Srila Prabhupadas books

you have posted two other good lines above one is this "Bring everyone to the authority, Srila Prabhupada" but you seem to want me to accept YOU as the authority, so tell me where I can find the authorised information concerning this.

Secondly you post this: " I have never seen anyone on this site refer someone to Srila Prabhupadas books for the answers to their questions." Here I asking you to do the thing you say no-one does and you tell me it is absurd.

I am starting to think that you are here for no other reason than to find an argument. Please prove me wrong. I hope that I am wrong

I ask you again to educate me and provide a reference. Please dont give me any "injunctions outside the scope of Prabhupadas books" which you say yourself we should not do.

Lastly another quote from one of your posts in this thread "Prabhupada clearly says; "There is nothing more to be said. Whatever I had to say, I have already said in my books"

So once again please provide a reference to sort this out for me. I cant find one myself.

I have looked

Also I looked at your other posts on this site and I cannot see anywhere where YOU are glorifying Srila Prabhupada, so come on mate, put your references where your mouth is : )

PS I am challenging you only so you might reveal this information to me, I have no other intent. Imagine what I could learn from you if you were only willing inform me rather than something else.

thanks for the discussion so far. Maybe you can go over to the Pariprashnena thread and help me there

>Webster defines it as; "to make glorious by bestowing honor, praise or admiration, to elevate to celestial glory, to represent as glorious, glory to as in worship". Can you >honestly say that these definitions are taking place here regarding Srila Prabhupada?

Dont you think that putting up and participating in a website about Prabhupadas teachings such as this is not in itself an act of glorification, and a practical one?
What do you mean by glorifying, chanting out loud Jaya Prabhupada?, telling everybody he is our saviour 1000 times, extolling again and again his transcendental qualities?
For that specific way there hundreds of websites. It is easy nowadays to build a website with 2000 photos, classes and lots of eulogies, heck you could put the VyasaPuja books and that would make it.
We are taught that satisfaction of the spiritual master is the key for spiritual advancement.
What do you think Prabhupada would be more pleased upon?

Dont let Mishra distract you from the references : )

Dear Priyavrata Prabhu, _/\o_

this is the first time I hear my replies astound anyone so Id like to know what specifically you refer to.

Feel free to contact me thru websites listed in my profile. But not if you want to focus on post-mortem ritvik theory. Ive written about it before and dont want to waste time with it anymore since I havent seen any precedent to it in genuine Vaishnava sampradayas so far. If you have such an example, Id be willing to discuss it though.

I personally know two Priyavratas - "FFL" and "Swedish" - and you dont sound like any of them.

ys Jan

Its obvious that this particular subject matter doesnt require referencing. It is simply a question of etiquette, sincerity, and humility on the part of the disciple. It would certainly be out of character for Srila Prabhupada to instruct His disciples to glorify Him. To glorify Srila Prabhupada goes without saying. Prabhupada demonstrated it by example. If anyone listens to the audios or views the videos of morning walks, room conversations, classes, lectures etc., or speaks to any senior disciple who had personal association, It is there. We can see and hear time and time again Srila Prabhupada glorifying His Guru Maharaja. Never taking credit for anything. When someone would glorify Him He would immediately glorify His Guru Maharaja by saying;" I am simply repeating what my spiritual master has said. Personally, I have no qualification". Can anyone say that this is not so? He always glorified His spiritual master by example not by reference. Thats absurd as I have already stated. So, to reference this in His books is not possible. It is something that is simply understood and executed by the sincere disciple. Otherwise, you are thinking yourself to be equal to or higher than your own Guru Maharaja. Why do you need a reference on this subject anyway? Are you opposed to glorifying Srila Prabhupada? Do you actually have to be instructed by Him to do so, or have some Vedic reference before you decide whether or not your going to. It is the natural reaction of the sincere disciple to glorify his Guru Maharaja. If thats the case, and you truly feel that you must have reference to glorify Prabhupada than we have nothing further to discuss. If you have to be told to glorify Prabhupada than you guys are in some serious sad shape. This should not have to be pointed out. It should be your natural desire and great pleasure to do so. If not, oh well, what can be done? You were obviously not trained up properly. Otherwise, we wouldnt be discussing this. If you dont have the feeling in your heart to glorify Srila Prabhupada, than nothing I, or anyone else says really matters. You will continue to do exactly what your doing.

To abrennan; come on mate, lets have a go at it, as you say. :) Im starting to like you for some reason or another. I think its your tenacity. You may have the Ksatriya spirit after all. If you are truly serious, than put down the sword for a minute, but be careful, you may learn something.

I think Priyavrata is a ritvik...lol

Arguing gets you nowhere.

Potential for criticism is unlimited. Potential for glorification is unlimited. Your time and energy is not. Use it wisely.

To abhiram; Actually, I am without any knowledge whatsoever. All I know is what Prabhupada said and taught by His example. Thats it. If you insist on putting a label on me for that, its your prerogative. Could you please explain to me abhiram prabhu, what a ritvik is?

To sitapati; The potential for puffed up ego is also unlimited. If your only input here is this statement, than you have successfully increased the potential for criticism, rather than glorification. Youre so advanced Bubba, what is your understanding of this matter? Please enlighten me prabhu, as I dont want to use my time unwisely as you say, by foolishly attempting to glorify Prabhupada to those who do not wish to hear.

this thread is starting to get interesting...
:)

Priyavrata P.:
insisting like you do reminds me of the ritviks, no arguments, just hammering same thing as if nobody but you knows how to glorify Prabhupada and dismissing totally any personal realization. Sorry to be so candid, but nobody pays me to be otherwise :)
Label or no label, that is what transpires.
Are you a ritvik, that is one who thinks there is nobody now in the planet that can give diksha and therefore ritvik priest is needed? Please answer.

By all means mishra prabhu, please continue to be candid. No need for apology. I appreciate your straight forwardness. Lets get down to the nitty gritty as they say, shall we. I have not personally met everyone on the planet therefore, I cannot with any confidence, answer that question.

OK, lets narrow it a bit, do you think anybody in ISKCON or the Gaudiya Math nowadays is qualified to give diksha?

All I know is Srila Prabhupada, and I am quite satisfied with that. Others in the institutions you mention, I cannot say. As I do not know any of them.

Mishra prabhu, Now I understand you. No I am not a ritvik!

I am not with ant particular camp. If thats your real question.

oh! so you are one of "those" prabhupada disciples.

anyway...

I dont know what you mean Bubaji. Please explain.

anyway, your arguments are pointing to ritvikism, it is clear for me.
one last question, were you initiated by Srila Prabhupada in his manifest lila?
(As you said you are Prabhupada disciple)
If so, can you give me please place and date of your diksha ceremony o letter by Srila Prabhupada?

Is this a bad thing? Being a ritvik.

just to make sure you are not one of "those" Prabhupada disciples as abhiram said.
Please answer.

Why is this becoming the new issue. "Those disciples", Ritviks. What is this? Why the sudden change up? All of these questions are completely irrelevant. Let us stick to the question at hand. I seen through you in the very beginning and I am seeing through you again now. From the beginning of this thread all of the participants have attempted to discredit me in one way or another in order to dismiss or avoid the question. You even attempted to delete it at one point yesterday. However, due to your own set of rules for this forum you needed my permission, and I assure you I realize you could have deleted it anyway. But as not to appear unfair or prejudice to your users, you let it slide, at least for now. Now, you feel as though you may have some ammunition to dismiss me in some way with some bogus bullshit by asking me these questions. If you are sincere in your KC and true to the name of your site, then let it play out naturally. The camp I attend is not relevant to the question. Let it go. Pariprashenena. I made my submissive inquiry. Practice what you preach. Lets stick to the question. No-one has given an honest answer yet except abrennan. At least with him, you know what youre dealing with. But you guys, who knows. The Masquerade Ball is your obvious scene. You never really attempted to answer the question in the first place because you know that you fall short in that respect and you tried to recover from it with the stats you presented. You stated it was a five minute, non extensive search. However it took you almost three hours to post them. By the way, those were not very impressive figures. Otherwise you would have answered it directly, right off the bat. Now, due to your envious nature, you are thinking you may have found a way to get rid of this thread while simultaneously getting rid of me either by calling me a Ritvik or the other thing you stated, one of "Those devotees". You want to delete this thread off the site so bad you can practically taste it. Is it not? If I am incorrect, please accept my apology. If not, let us continue. This is obviously too much for you guys to handle. You all seem quite disturbed. Fear not, you made your points quite clear. Furthermore, you reveal your true selves far to easily. You may want to consider working on that, so that you can be prepared for any future Priyavratas.

thread closed and Priyavrata user banned so that we can dedicate our time to glorify Srila Prabhupada.