Pariprashnena — Q&A Archive

can you please give an example?

you mean like this one?
http://www.sivaramaswami.com/?cat=14

why is this posted on SV swamis site?
http://www.sivaramaswami.com/?p=2487

There are two types of Krishna-katha: praising Krishna and talking down engagement in Maya.

This fits into the second category. It is designed to undermine your faith in the material arrangements of modern civilization.

Try reading the first canto puports for many examples of Prabhupada preaching in this way.

The articles on the site do not talk down material engagement. Why? Because they are presented as straightforward news without any comment. On its own, the fact that marijuana is now available in vending machines, that laughter is good for you, and that share prices are falling certainly isnt Krsna-katha. You may as well read the newspaper. Without any comment by Maharaja, an innocent net surfer might even conclude that Sivarama Swami endorses marijuana vending machines or that he has a particular interest in share prices, or that we should now practice laughter as part of our sadhana! Imagine, what would you think if you were listening to a class where someone simply read out one of these articles? Would that be an enlightening class? No. Could you imagine Back to Godhead magazine with such articles without a purport? No.

If the articles were presented with some comment on the futility of material enjoyment and the suffering that accompanies it, then it could be useful. This format would qualify as talking down material engagement and have a practical effect in undermining faith in material activities, and this is the format Prabhupada used in his preaching. But as articles on their own, without any purport, they dont have any particular practical use for us.

So my response to the question would be, devotee websites should refrain from posting news articles unless the article is accompanied by a clear Krishna conscious purport.

Try reading the articles in the context of the other content on Maharajas site, such as his podcasts. The articles are not posted in isolation.

Read them in context of Planet ISKCON.

Or better yet, write your website and make a contribution to the whole endeavour. :-)

Send me the rss feed and Ill hook it up to Planet ISKCON, and then people can give you feedback on what you should be doing. After all, I dont think Maharaja reads Pariprashnena.com.

mishraji, isnt www.vedanews.com your website?

It is not "my website" albeit I appear as administrative contact. I do not even own the domain :).

All www.iskcontech.com projects are a conjoint effort of devotees so nobody claims ownership or "fatherhood" of any of them.

None of those sites are on any political side or promote webmaster personal conclusions on philosophy or social issues, but are designed as a service for vaishnavas.

www.vedanews.com is a specific clearly delineated world news site for devotees, not a spiritual masters website.

Maybe you can understand or adapt those posts and give them an explanation, but you are one isolated case in millions that should be given a clear perspective from scratch.

At least the Krishna conscious commentaries on the news should be clear enough situated, not scattered and you figure out what podcast or article is referring to that.

Shivaram Swamis site is open on the internet, Prabhu, not a private gathering of knowledgeable disciples or a private conference on COM. That seems to be the complain.

It would definitely help in these cases to know how any news article or mundane subject is related to discussion on Krsna consciousness.

Well, why not write to Sivarama Swami and tell him how he should do his website?

asksrs@gmail.com is his email address.

Or why not write a "commentary on Sivarama Swamis website" website.

Oh, hang on, thats what were doing...
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Its not hard to make the connection if you already know the philosophy. You guys are playing it up for controversy. Misra, the vedanews site is even more removed from direct KC philosophy "straight outta the Gita", and dont pretend that whoever is involved in it is not taking the role of instructor (guru) for the reading public. :-)
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As I understand it, and I may be wrong: those posts are not by H.H Sivarama Swami himself, they are by his secretary who puts them on there to keep some material flowing through, and also as means of self-expression. Its their contribution to the preaching. Remember that you are basically criticizing, sorry "critiquing" someones personal contribution here.

I can understand the intent of the person behind them - its to cast light on whats going on around the world. What kind of conclusion you draw is left to your own realization, just like vedanews.
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At the end of the day the only real critique is a superior result, as Srila Prabhupada demonstrated. *Anyone* can denounce, and everyones offering, including all of us who have chimed in on this thread, has some fault that can be exposed. What we need are people who can actually show something in practice. If you really think that Sivarama Swamis site would be better with more commentary, then write to him or leave a comment on his site to suggest it, or write a Greasemonkey script that displays his site along with commentary on his site drawn from your "Commentary on Sivarama Swamis website" blog, and make it available to the public. :-P

Or write a website that can serve as an ideal example:

"If you have a success story to tell, then tell it. If you dont, but you know what to do, then get some credibility - go out and do it. If you dont know what to do, but you know someone who does, then follow them. If none of the above, then whatever you do, dont waste time fruitlessly criticizing others."

Im serious about writing the commentary. If you really feel it needs commentary, and you dont want to write a whole site on your own, then you can do some humble service to H.H. Sivarama Swami by adding commentary to the news articles that appear there.

Do you have permission from Shivaram Swami to publish his email address here? Better check with him.

You say that probably the webmaster does it "to keep some material flowing through, and also as means of self-expression". I doubt the Swami will approve the way those articles are posted.

"Is not hard to make the connection if you already know the philosophy" Exactly, but obviously the internet is populated by millions of individuals that are not acquainted with the philosophy. And we have to make it clear if a site is for news, for philosophical works etc and if it is mixed, the connection should be clear for those people (the overwhelming majority) that are not informed, including people brand new to KC.

I do not understand why you get so upset when it is so clear. If on those articles, there is a vaishnava commentary, then nobody will complain about that happening in a "initiating guru" personal website.

Btw, you are not honouring your "no-fault-finding" philosophy, you are nailing me for a reason that escapes me!!!

Prabhu, I dont have a "no-fault-finding philosophy" (?), and Im not nailing you. Im just being consistent. If were going to go on someones website for not having a Krishna conscious purport to news stories, then wed have to admit that vedanews.com does the same thing. Is there an application of this idea of KC purports for vedanews.com? You may not be able to change Sivarama Swamis site, but you could do something about vedanews.com.

I notice that recently people have been posting news stories with purports on Planet ISKCON, but I dont know if thats related to this discussion, unless mystically. :-)

Sivarama Swamis email address is on his website. Youll notice, though, if you go to this page: http://www.sivaramaswami.com/?page_id=1162 that it goes to Braja Sevaki dd. She is actually the person that you would suggest the change to.

Just remember that its someones personal website, and Im not sure how well it goes over when people get up on a soap box and start telling other people what they should and shouldnt do with their personal contribution. People can be sensitive about that because its intimately connected with them as a person. They get upset when you start treating it insensitively or impersonally. Of course, people often appreciate assistance, appreciation, and useful advice, as long as its delivered nicely. :-)

Sivaram Swami has posted silly mundane news stories, no Iskcon site,wether personal or official needs to post usless stories about the material world, espcecialy when there is no meaningfull commentary.It appears that the site managers are just looking for ways to add more content to the site.

Two days ago I presented our question through Maharajas website. I got the following from the site administrator: (Please note I did not ask her permission to post this correspondence, but she does know that there is another web discussion going on about Maharajas site)

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Before I send this to Maharaja, I will comment myself, as I am the site editor. Maharaja does choose most of the news items himself. They are, all of them, indications of the degradation of the world, the advance of Kali-yuga, and the lack of spiritual values or knowledge. Surely that much is obvious?

Regarding your other statement, it is not correct that "it is just news and on its own doesnt have any particular relevance for us as devotees." Its not "just" a news site, nor are items posted randomly or on their own: it doesnt take much intelligence to deduce that the news items being posted are themselves commentaries on the sad state of the world. It seems that some people, however, are easily addled by the obvious, so I will suggest to Maharaja that he makes a comment on the news story so that those who are currently disturbed, arent. If that is possible for them.

But, in conclusion, it should be noted that www.sivaramaswami.com is a 100% Krishna conscious website: it does not, has never, and will never advocate adharmic principles, nor promote unprincipled, materialistic values, nor support those who do. You can quote me on that. If someone think www.sivaramaswami.com is guilty of any of these things...well, you cant please everyone, can you? :) It should be very obvious--even without commentaries--that these articles are posted to make devotees more aware of the importance of preaching and book distribution.

Thank you for your mail. Im sure you concern will result in an improved category. Please note that since Maharaja leaves for India within a few short days, I doubt he will have time to answer any more questions on the site apart from the ones he has already been sent. I will try and discuss this with him when he arrives here in Mayapur.

Hare Krishna
your servant
Braja Sevaki dd
Site Administrator

===========================

In the next correspondence she replied:

".....I will ask Maharaja to post a comment, so that those who are currently disturbed arent. I also said its unintelligent to "conclude" that the news story--posted on a Krishna conscious site--is anything *but* a comment on the state of the world. How could it be anything else? To be disturbed about that means theres a chance it is promoting materialistic or adharmic values, ie: the stock market article, the Sai Baba article, etc. What is the stock market article posted for? Lamenting that our shares may have devalued? No :) It is an indication that the world is gliding down to hell, that there is no security in supporting and promoting materialistic values. I do not think it is required to post commentaries for such articles, but since some people are disturbed, since they are unable to draw the proper conclusions (ie: their intelligence is clouded by ??), then as I said, Ill ask Maharaja to comment on some articles.

Anyway it may be some time before this changes, as Maharaja is leaving for India in a few days, so lets see what he says. Until then, I really dont think the universe will stop turning, do you :)

Hare Krishna :)
your servant
Braja Sevaki dd

Hahahaha!

So you see, Im just channelling Braja Sevaki. :-)

The other culprit that you can go after is ISKCON News.com. The editor there is none other than our beloved Ekendra das - hes the front man for Mukunda Goswami, Anuttama das, and a few others...

There are many good examples of devotee commentary on current news events, heres one excellent example:

Food prices around the world have spiked because of higher oil prices, needed for fertilizer, irrigation and transportation. Prices for basic ingredients such as corn and wheat are also up sharply, and the increasing global demand for biofuels is pressuring food markets as well. The problem is particularly dire in the Caribbean, where island nations depend on imports and food prices are up 40 percent in places.

Poor Haitians resort to eating dirt

"Harassed by famine and excessive taxes, people will resort to eating leaves, roots, flesh, wild honey, fruits, flowers and seeds. Struck by drought, they will become completely ruined."

- Srimad Bhagavatam 12.2.9

Srimad-Bhagavatam authoritatively describes the future of our planet. Just as a leaf disconnected from a plant or tree dries up, withers and disintegrates, when human society is disconnected from the Supreme Lord it withers up and disintegrates in violence and chaos. Despite our computers and rockets, if the Supreme Lord does not send rain we shall all starve.

The rest of the article is here: http://www.atmayogi.com/node/572

the reason for the question was obvious.
the internet is open so do not think everybody is a (smart) devotee as you and can relate things so badly disposed in that site.
the answer from sitapati and the webmaster is overreacted with personal accusations and challenges, and at the end the question will help that site to be more clear.
Now, you tell me who is offensive.

I took the advice provided here and tried to read Maharajas news articles in the context of the other material on the site. Call me stupid but I just couldnt make the connection between marijuana vending machines and the "Colours of Prem" podcast. Both topics seem to me to be impractical and irrelevant for most devotees.

..here is a quote from a GBC members personal web-site,the author belives that this is important knowledge to be sharing with the world:

..." When the dog arrives at his last moment, he goes and pisses all over the mosque'92s outer wall " , is this person fit to be an Iskcon GBC ?

Here is another example of devotee commentary - written by Chandidasa dasa:

Forget meditation! A company called HeartMath provides the anti-stress iPod that uses bio-feedback. Hear about the device here.

It is a little box, about the size of an iPod, that takes your pulse when you put your thumb on it. It measures the micro-variations in pulse speed (similar to the pulse checking that Chinese and Ayurvedic doctors use) that determine which emotional state your brain is in. The blinks red if you are stressed out. You can then apply various relaxation techniques and the device tells you when you have managed to calm down.

Surprisingly, the best technique for reducing stress that the company recommends is appreciation. Thinking of something or someone you appreciate is a sure fire way of reducing stress. In Krishna consciousness we do this all the time. There is (or should be) so much appreciating: you appreciate your fellow devotee, your spiritual master, your food, your body, your mind (when you'92re not beating it into submission), your spiritualize intelligence, etc. So, Krishna consciousness, both directly, by meditation, and indirectly, by appreciation, reduces stress. Pretty cool, huh?

However, the ultimate goal of Krishna conscious meditation and appreciation is not to de-stress. That is just a welcome side-effect. The real goal is to stop repeated birth and death. No matter how stress-free you are, the body is still going to die.

So, Krishna gives it both: the best short-term anti-stress techniques and the best long-term solution. The HeartMath EmWave is useful because it can scientifically tell you how well the former is working.

From http://www.deltaflow.com/?p=435

Maybe he is trying to draw readers from search engines by posting straight up news stories. It could be a preaching strategy that he hopes once they are at his site, they will also read the KC stuff. Not every devotee site needs to be aimed only at devotees.

Mantra 11. Only one who can learn the process of nescience and that of transcendental knowledge side by side can transcend the influence of repeated birth and death and enjoy the full blessings of immortality.

Sri Isopanisad

Another side is how should devotees get there news of the world we are stuck in? By immersing themselves in the mass media or by seeing articles filtered by a devotee that they can use as intellectual stimulus.

I think teaching someone to think on their own is better than telling them what to think.

the site is nice but when i read those news there it was like reading cnn.
maybe someone can tell them about this thread because maybe they are not aware that this news they post are not liked by devotees as seen here.

As we can see there are examples of devotees that give commentary on current news stories...its definitely helpful for making the connection for newcomers not neccessarily older devotees.

delicious!

Yes. Please write commentary to all the karmi demon maya world news articles on ISKCON News and send them to me via the contact us page.

Wed love to get in touch with you if youre willing to write introductions to these articles. Please be aware that they need to be understandable to the general public (no sanskrit, jargon or unfamiliar philosophical concepts unless youre willing and capable of giving a succinct explanation + all submissions are subject to editing)

Were looking forward to your decontaminating us.

same for vedanews.com, but we better the offer:
* you can select and publish yourself the news and comment it with a few clicks
* we promise not to edit (unless utterly displaced or unintelligible)
:)

no slant, me thinks the Chineese have the BEST perspective on life lollol

[quote][cite] ekendra:[/cite]Were looking forward to your decontaminating us.[/quote]

Your the man Ekendra :)

"In life we are accustomed to thinking either of the material or of the spiritual energy. Now, how can we transfer our thoughts from the material energy to the spiritual energy? There are so many literatures which fill our thoughts with the material energy -- newspapers, magazines, novels, etc. Our thinking, which is now absorbed in these literatures, must be transferred to the Vedic literatures. The great sages, therefore, have written so many Vedic literatures, such as the Puranas. The Puranas are not imaginative; they are historical records."

From BG Introduction

Deena prabhu, so take some of the time that you spend writing on Pariprashnena.com and channel it into making a website that can become an example of what you think it should be, and then you can point to it and say, "See, like this," or others can do that for it, if it answers a need strongly enough to animate them.

stop hammering poor deena, sitapati, :) is it so hard to accept the simple point of correcting a few astray articles without comment in a guru s website? Even its webmaster has admited (although bit pissed off by the remark).

Sure devotee sites should post mundane news, comment on mundane news and relate to mundane news. we are not a sect, we want to relate to the world. is someone took karma sannyas that a different story.

Otherwise all of the hypocrites and dropouts will just go and use non devotee websites to look for news.

in fact we should have devotees running biggest magazines and newspapers, owning google and yahoo, be best lawyers and journalists, be in the government and show a good example, and NOT be a dropouts from a hippy movement, irrelevant and sectarian.

huh that was a comment..

OK, OK, mishra... :-)

Although I hear that ISKCON News.net is looking for writers...

"The next impediment to devotional service is prajalpa, talking of mundane subject matter. Many people unnecessarily talk of the daily happenings in the newspapers and pass the time without any profit. A devotee, however, does not indulge in unnecessary talks of politics or economics."

From Narada Bhakti Sutra Chapter 1 Verse 5

Therefore only necessary should be selected by devotees for devotees to protect devotees from prajalpa. If KC to expand to a worldwide religion, if.. then its a must. ys

It seems to me that all the information we ever need to know about the material world and maya is contained completely in Srila Prabhupadas books, do we really need to bolster or qualify that? Dont we stand on the power of SPs books to convince others and ourselves about the material world?

if you are honest about the above statement, you should never put a question here or should never read anything on Pariprasnena or any other devotee site. You wrote: "It seems to me that all the information we ever need to know about the material world and maya is contained completely in Srila Prabhupadas books"

In any case one need at least some pramana for such a radical or some may say a sectarian statement. What is yours (even if it is not based on smrti, we still want to hear it)? ys

So all the devotee websites including this one are completely full of mundane subject matters like the news...lol mmm
I am sure you dont actually think that SPs books arent enough for us to understand the material world and the material energy...or maybe you do ccd!

I challenge you to provide any support to your statement that EVERYTHING ANYONE EVER will need to know is in Prabhupadas books. From my perspective or from perspective of any sane person its a false statment. The correct statement is that for a disciple his books are sufficient to learn about the material world, not that everything about material world is contained in his books.

Whoever is here who never ever looked at the mundane news please raise your hands...

[quote][cite] ccd:[/cite]I challenge you to provide any support to your statement that EVERYTHING ANYONE EVER will need to know is in Prabhupadas books.[/quote]
My observation was "It seems to me that all the information we ever need to know about the material world and maya is contained completely in Srila Prabhupadas books"....that is different from saying "everything about the material world is contained in SPs books".
By your own admittance it is true - "The correct statement is that for a disciple his books are sufficient to learn about the material world...." - actually for everyone it is sufficient....hence SPs repeated emphasis on mass book distribution.
The original discussion was not about who has looked at mundane news, it was about whether we should include mundane material (esp. without commentary) on devotee websites.

...yes Mishra you are correct the story " House of Paper " on Sivarama Swamis web-site is total nonsense, I personal find the site very offensive,He has a picture of Srila Prabhupada on the home page , but does not give it respect by telling us who He is,and in typicial GBC style He makes a big deal about who He ( Sivarama Swami ) is.

we probably did not have much impact:
http://www.sivaramaswami.com/?p=2615

...Prabhupadas books do in fact contain everything you need to know, but we must fully understand this statement, the material world is an illusion " maya ", its all temporary , the ONLY purpose of human life is to cultivate Krishna Conciousness , as instructed in Prabhupadas books.This does not mean that we all become material world " zombies " , no , we have to struggle to maintain our material bodies,according to our individual karma , this is punishment , not the goal of human life.